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Grudem on Baptist Reformed Theology

Tulip“Among denominations in contemporary evangelicalism, Methodists and Nazarenes tend to be thoroughly Arminian, whereas Presbyterians and the Christian Reformed tend to be thoroughly Reformed (at least by denominational statement of faith). Both views are found among Baptists…” p. 338

“There is a long history of acceptance of the doctrine [of election] as here presented, but many others have objected to it as well. Among current evangelicals, those in more Reformed or Calvinistic circles will accept this view, as will many Lutherans and Anglicans and a large number of Baptists and people in independent churches.” p. 680

“Many within the Wesleyan/Arminian tradition have held that it is possible for someone who is truly born again to lose his or her salvation, while Reformed Christians have held that that is not possible for someone who is truly born again. Most Baptists have followed the Reformed tradition at this point; however, they have frequently used the term “eternal security” or the “eternal security of the believer” rather than the term “perseverance of the saints“. p. 788-789

Thus we might conclude that the Baptist tradition has not always been strongly rooted in the Arminian view, but has a history of a considerable Reformed influence. More importantly, in order to uphold one of the core values of the contemporary Baptist movement, namely discussion, we might expect to be engaged and welcome a similar debate among ourselves also today.

Grudem, W. (1994) Systematic Theology. England: Intervarsity Press.

 
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Posted by on August 5, 2014 in Theology

 

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Heaven Is For Real vs. Bible 2/2

 

Heaven Timeheaven time

Still, how could Colton see all this? His father Todd mentioned a possibility of “heaven time”, suggesting that concepts of – past, present and future are perhaps valid only for earth, while time in heaven might not be linear. The nature of time and Gods relation to it is closely related both to our individual but also collective future “times” and I will assess it at least briefly. Grudem agrees with God being a timeless being, which does not experience a succession of moments, as his experience of time is qualitatively different. He does not attempt to specify how this could be but only writes, “To God himself, all of his existence is always somehow “present,” (Grudem 1994: 169). Divine timelessness has been the dominant view of Christian orthodoxy throughout the history of the church. However, Grudem suggests that it is not true that heaven itself will be timeless. Based on several descriptions of heaven from the book of revelation[1] he argues that “there will be a succession of moments one after another” and that we will not experience “an exact duplication of God’s attribute of eternity” (Grudem 1994: 173). Others like Professor William Lane Craig, who worked extensively with the Christian philosophy of time deny divine omnitemporality[2] altogether. Craig argues for temporal becoming or a dynamic theory of time (also called an A-Theory of time) in which past is no longer here, future has yet to come and the only thing that is really in existence is present. In his essay “God, Time, and Eternity”, he concludes: “God is timeless without creation and temporal subsequent to creation.” (Craig 2002).

In both cases, Todd’s proposition of heaven time seems inadequate. Cessation or interfusion of time after our physical death is certainly not a doctrine held by most mainstream evangelicals; neither has it been well established in the belief systems of other major Christian denominations. Read the rest of this entry »

 
 

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Heaven Is For Real vs. Bible 1/2

Heaven is for realA New York Times article from March 11, 2011 describes the Thomas Nelson broken sales records after publishing the book “Heaven is for Real.[1]  While there were initially in print only 40,000 copies, this book has gone back to press 22 times, now reaching 8 million printed copies. In a similar article[2] almost 3 years later, we follow its still continuing success on popular bestseller lists. With the TriStar Pictures movie version of this book, released on April 16, 2014 this story became a great deal of the western popular discussion about heaven and the life after life. In the following lines I will analyze some of the main ideas one can extract from reading this book and compare them to what some of the Biblical scholars have over centuries orderly summarized in doctrines of eschatology. After all the reasoning I will try to show how can we correctly understand what truly happened but also what meaning can Colton’s story have for you.

Heaven is for Real

Over 6000 Amazon customer reviews speak of the impact this publication had on peoples lives. To mention a few, B. Prickett wrote “This is a wonderful book. If you have any doubts about what happens after death, read this book. It will become clear to you.” or Sophia Maria Hall said, “We all need hope that there is better after the life we have here on this crazy earth…this is proof we are getting that!” Also, Cynthia Trueblood shared that “This book was written in an easy style and yet impacted my view of heaven profoundly!”[3] While one can find also more disapproving comments, those above do represent the majority. Words like “clear”, “proof” or “profound impact” are frequently used to describe the effect this material had on its readers and their view of heaven. Now, what does this book actually say about heaven? Read the rest of this entry »

 
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Posted by on April 22, 2014 in Reasonable Faith, Reviews, Theology

 

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… #Resurrection #Judgment(s) #FutureKingdom

the-second-coming

Previous: Christianity: #AfterDeath #Rapture.  As next appeared the matter of tribulation and antichrist. Dufield and Cleave described these in detail offering much scriptural reference regarding the identity and the various titles of antichrist. As for the tribulation, they outlined the difference between the tribulation of the church, Israel nation and the special time of Gods final wrath for which they suggested a chronological succession (Duffield 1983: 568-577). Wright has not revealed his explanation of these passages, but only asked for the next question.

At this point, the host asked the bishop Wright about his view on resurrection. He then clarified that resurrection is different from the paradise mentioned earlier in the discussion, thus calling it “the life after life after death”. In his view, the resurrection is bodily, yet it will not take place in some distant dwelling place, but will “be brought to birth in this world” and be transformed in the old field of space, time and matter. Again, he cautioned the audience against thinking in dimensions of the Platonic dualism of body and soul, which is sometimes also inaptly reflected in several biblical translations as “a physical body” and “a spiritual body” rather than the “corruptible” and “incorruptible” one. (Wright 2008: kindle location 2403-2607). Both Duffield and Cleave supported Wrights words concerning the bodily resurrection and hereby denied a sort of immaterial, disembodied, eternal existence of a soul. Jesus as the firstfruit of those who slept (1. Cor. 15:20), they said, is a guarantee of resurrection for all the believers. As it seemed to be the custom of the evenings debate, the Pentecostals presented us anew with more unravelled details of these events. They divided resurrection into several consecutive occurences in which believers are to experience the first, good resurrection (Rev. 20:6), while the unrighteous must wait until after the Millennium to then endure the resurrection of damnation (Jn.5:29) (Duffield 1983: 578-589).

This prompted a question from the audience, which inquired whether there would therefore be also more than just one judgment. They affirmed this by listing a variety of judgments that will first include believers (1.Cor. 11:31), Nations (Mt.25.31-46) and Israel (Ez. 20:33-38), then the wicked will be judged near the white throne (Rv. 20:11-14) and at last the focus will turn at Satan and fallen angels (Rv. 20:14). In this exposition they also maintained different rewards in heaven and degrees of judgment in hell. (Duffield 1983: 599-607). When receiving the word, Wright strongly acknowledged the concept of the final judgment, yet remained rather sceptical in regard to all the above mentioned particularities. He however, turned the attention of all to, by many disputed, importance of justification by works. He said “for Paul, there was no clash between present justification by faith and future judgment according to works. The two actually need, and depend upon, one another.”

At last came the long awaited query concerning heaven, hell and the final destination. Much whisper spread among the listeners after Wrights explication of his idea of hell as a certain dehumanization of people. Based on the presupposition that people become like what they worship one can, by turning away from God and worshiping other things, enter an ex-human state. As for the eternal bliss, he repeated his earlier words and summarized his efforts of the nights debate to depict heaven according to the Lord’s Prayer “Thy kingdom come on earth as in heaven.” Duffield and Cleave were outraged and boldly claimed that no teaching is clearer than that of a final destiny beyond this present life on earth. Then they reminded us of some of the classic vivid portrayals of hell as unquenchable fire and a special abode of undying worms. Equally, heaven is in their view a distinct place of eternal happiness and joy.

All in all Wright seems to be more political and earthly oriented leaving many of the passages regarding the eschaton as a mere metaphors and illustrations while Duffield & Cleave holding on to the traditional and more literal interpretations of the Scriptures. In his approach is Wright building on the fact that God pronounced the earth good, and as a good creation, he will not simply destroy it but will regenerate it to its original design. Duffield & Cleave have no such hopes for the present world and are quick to abandon the earthly realm for the future divine scenes of heaven and hell.

 
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Posted by on March 7, 2014 in Theology

 

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The week deal


“Next to faith this is the highest art — to be content with the calling in which God has placed you.”

Martin Luther


 

Psalm 23;

 
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Posted by on March 1, 2014 in The week deal

 

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Christianity: #AfterDeath #Rapture

EKG flatlineIn a hypothetic Q&A, panel discussion between the Anglican bishop N.T. Wright and the Pentecostals Duffield & Cleave, it could easily happen that an audience might be leaving such event more puzzled than upon arrival. Based on their publications on the topic of eschatology they persuasively argue for their perspectives. While overlapping in some of the rough outlining, they offer two widely different interpretations of the scriptural data. A thought-out critic now offers his fabricated record of this speculative happening.

Immediately after opening words and a presentation of the speakers, the debate was innitiated with a question “what happens to a person immediately after his physical death?

Both parties joined in a co-operative rejection of the Roman Catholic notion of purgatory. While Dufield & Cleave argued that the concept is based on extra-canonical apocryphic material of the book of Maccabees (Duffield 1983: 523), Wright pointed out its 13. and 14. century origin in the works of Aquinas and Dante. (Wright 2008: kindle location 2643). Further on Cleave warned us against additional two misconceptions of soul sleeping and spiritism. Then Duffield continued in describing the distinct paths first for the wicked, who will abide in a place called „Hades“, based on the Hebrew and Greek interpretations of the words Sheol and Gehenna, and supported by the account of the rich man and Lazarus (Lk.16:23; 1 Pt.3:19). And secondly the righteous who will spent the intermiediate state between the death and the final resurrection in a place called „paradise“. Among else he based this claim on Jesus‘ words on the cross “today, shalt thou be with me in paradise“ (Lk. 23:43)(Duffield 1983: 520-521). Wright appeared to be more discreet in his assertions saying that Christians will without a difference of status be in a place we can call heaven. (Wright 2008: kindle location 2680-2706). On the condition of the unrighteous he remained silent.

purgatory

As second, were the debaters asked about the rapture and the second coming. Here once more Cleave took the word and defended the traditional pre-millennial and pre-tribulational view in which Jesus should come again, literally descending from heaven, taking deceased and living saints to a place He prepared for them (Acts 1:11; John 14:3,1; Thes. 4:16-17)(Duffield 1983: 535-536). To everyones surprise Wright answered with questioning the very notion of “snatching up” believers into heaven. In showing that the Greek word parousia does not mean “coming“ as much as “presence“ he began to explain the widely neglected meaning of transformation behind these allegedly misrepresented verses (Phil. 3:20;1.Cor. 15:51-54). Adding three powerful metaphors of Moses coming down from the mountain, Daniels persecution and an emperors visit he showed the meaning of the used illustrations of trumpets, clouds and meeting the royalty to escort him into the city. Namely, that it is not about us going elsewhere but about the King in the sound of trumpets appearing in His kingdom, being present in his mother city and restoring it to its true identity (1.John 2:28; 3:2). In saying that the heaven and the earth will join, he refused his colleagues’ “spaceman descending from sky” theory (Wright 2008: kindle location 2085-2184).

 
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Posted by on February 19, 2014 in Theology

 

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Apologetic evening with Dr. Frank Turek

Apologetic evening

Frank Turek is from USA and is one of the well known debaters, writers and teachers. He has masters in public administration and a doctorate in apologetics. He also wrote a book “I don’t have enough faith to be an atheist”. Among others he debated such several times figures as Christopher Hitchens. Frank Turek is both entertaining and sharp.

After the seminar there will be an opportunity to ask questions and talk with him. All this at Skywalk, 12th of March at 19:00 (Kongens Ege, Gammel Hadsundvej 2, 8900 Randers, Denmark)

 
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Posted by on January 27, 2014 in News, Reasonable Faith

 

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